We will not try.

All attempts to describe Excepter’s music have thus far failed so we will not take it upon ourselves to describe it now. Electro, noise, experimental, these are just words. Have fun with them. But don’t attach them to things and try to give them meaning. It’s too late for that. In the right frame of mind Excepter might be dub and nothing else at all, but do our safety skins still have the guts to find that right frame of mind? It is hard to say. “But consider, my dear, how dull life would be without a little uncertainty in it.” John Cage wrote that.

Excepter is comprised of co-founders John Fell Ryan and Doug Hougland along with fellow core members Jon Nicholson and Nathan Corbin. Other members have come and gone, but these days auxiliary players Linda Casey, Lala Harrison and Clare Amory often join Excepter on stage. The instruments they employ include vocals, synths, drum box, electronics, percussion, piano, drums, flute and bass clarinet. Excepter’s latest release, Streams 01, came out this year on Fusetron.

This past winter we invited the Excepter family to our home base for dinner and booze. In the minutes before the band arrived we attempted to jot down some coherent questions, but mostly these were forgotten. We weren’t much interested in asking questions. What are your influences? How did you guys get together? Do you believe, as Lou Reed once did, that people should die for music? We are not concerned with the answers to these questions. Instead, we opened some bottles, we rolled our tapes and started talking. This is the only true salon.

Interview by Keach Hagey and Paul Menchaca
Written by PM

I. The Transfiguration Of Joanna Newsom Into A Young Bee

PM: We were actually joking about that.

KH: We said, “Let’s ask them questions as if they were Joanna Newsom.” [Laughs] Like [the interview] in Arthur. They wrote like 5,000 words about her.

PM: It was epic.

II. The Transfiguration Of Elijah Wood Into A White Horse

PM: What’s the guy from Lord of the Rings? The kid?

KH: Oh, Elijah Wood?

PM: Elijah Wood is playing Iggy Pop in a biopic.

KH: No!

Nathan: He’s short enough. [Laughter]

PM: But does he have the cock? Iggy Pop has the legendary, you know.

III. All Rocks Are Classic

Jon: What’s this we’re listening to?

Nathan: This is Yoko.

PM: This song is awesome. It’s my favorite song on the album.

Jon: Wow, I’ve never heard this.

JFR: I’ve never heard Steely Dan. There’s like this whole weird black hole from my past. [Laughter] Them and Mission of Burma.

PM: You’ve never heard Mission of Burma?

Linda: Nor I.

Jon: We saw Mission of Burma at fucking First Avenue!

Linda: I wasn’t paying attention.

Jon: They were awesome.

PM: I saw them play their first [reunion] show in New York at Irving Plaza and it was just crazy. It was insane.

Jon: I remember hearing about that.

PM: Dear god, they played two full sets. They played one full set, went offstage and came back and played another full set. It was crazy.

JFR: I’ve never heard Supertramp.

Linda: Oh now I love them.

Nathan: [Singing] ‘Take the long way home.’ You’ve never heard Supertramp?

JFR: I don’t listen to the radio.

Jon: Oh you should have been at our home the last few months, late at night.

KH: Yeah? Was it nonstop Supertramp?

Jon: Nonstop Supertramp.

Linda: I’m addicted to Breakfast of Champions.

PM: Yeah that’s Supertramp, right? See I always hated Supertramp actually. I fucking couldn’t stand Supertramp.

Linda: I rediscovered them.

Jon: I thought that I hated that stuff but it was through things like karaoke that I really rediscovered them.

PM: I don’t buy some of the shit that people claim to like. Like a lot more people are claiming to like Hall and Oates.

Nathan: No, no. You’ve got to hear, what’s their big hit?

Jon: “I Can’t Go for That”?

Nathan: You have to listen to “I Can’t Go for That” played at the right volume, at the right time.

PM: It just reminds me of hanging out at my grandmother’s house and my grandparents understood no English and so all you could possibly do was sit and be bored and watch MTV for hours and hours. That’s what all that shit reminds me of.

Linda: I have that same exact memory. Except it was at my cousin’s house.

PM: Yeah. It’s just bad 80s MTV so all the shit that comes back from the 80s as hip, I’ve just got bad memories of it.

Jon: So [last] Thursday night I’m the DJ for the fucking Christmas Party.

JFR: I heard there was fall out.

Jon: Huge fucking art gallery. They represent this guy [points to a print on the wall.] Anyway, they say bring hip-hop, bring new wave.

JFR: They asked you?

Jon: They gave me an envelope with $500 in it and they’re like, ‘Yeah, go on!” and I’m like, all right. And it starts with this guy saying, ‘Hey, do you have any Spandau Ballet?’ And I’m like I just brought a box of records. [Laughter] I didn’t bring three iPods and 400,000 songs. No I don’t have Spandau Ballet. And he’s like, play something with that feeling. And I thought that I brought pretty entry-level nightclub music or whatever.

PM: So what happened? Did they get pissed?

Nathan: Play James Brown!

JFR: Didn’t you read my Desert Island Discs about James Brown? [published by Dusted Magazine—Ed.] Talking about modern society, about how if you actually played the most danceable music like James Brown you would in fact not only vacate the premises, you’d end the city, end your friendships and people would stop talking to you. [Laughter]

Lala: That is so bad.

Jon: It got to the point where they were so pissed off they were like you have four more records. And I was angry that these people were fucking screaming at me and the owner was like, “Play 50 Cent! We want to see people bouncing!” And I was saying there are people dancing and they don’t seem to mind.

Nathan: Why spend all the money to hire a real DJ?

Jon: I put on fucking Huey Lewis and the News.

Linda: And they went crazy.

PM: Did they really?

Jon: They went crazy! And I was like it takes this fucking bullshit to awaken people?

KH: What did he play for them?

Linda: Huey Lewis and the News.

Jon: It was bullshit.

PM: It’s like “American Psycho”. ‘Sports was their best album.’

Jon: Yeah, it was called Sports. [Laughter]

III. The Roaring Silence

JFR: I got into a music fight at the office today. [Laughter] This guy was like how come there aren’t any timeless acts anymore? [Laughter] Are you serious man?

Nathan: I would just tell him to wait.

PM: Yeah, exactly.

JFR: ‘What happened to the 90s?’ I don’t know, you stopped giving a shit. [Laughter]

Nathan: All those great bands of the 90s are still playing today. Timeless. I think Throbbing Gristle is still playing.

Jon: They are still playing.

Linda: Didn’t Styx just have a show?

Nathan: You know who is fucking timeless is the Melvins, man. I think as far as a band goes they cease to amaze me.

JFR: They cease to amaze you?

Nathan: They don’t cease to amaze me.

Linda: They never cease to amaze you.

Jon: Bands like Mission of Burma, it’s so good to see bands like that because when I started getting into live music all those bands were breaking up. Like in ’84? They were already on their way out the door already.

PM: They were done.

Jon: So you’re like yeah I finally get my chance! Maybe it’s not like seeing them in someone’s garage but still.

PM: I’m not big on a whole lot of reunions but every once in a while they work. Mission of Burma totally worked as a reunion.

Dan: Whenever anyone says timeless, that’s a tricky term. There’s always an agenda. They’re promoting some agenda. Oh, this music is timeless. Who cares what’s timeless?

JFR: That’s what I teased this guy about. He said, ‘I just need something that 90 percent of the people I know will enjoy.’ And I was just like try silence, man. [Laughter]

Linda: Ninety percent of people don’t enjoy silence though.

JFR: Yeah but 90 percent of people don’t like music.

Jon: They don’t like music.

JFR: Music for them is along the same level as wallpaper.

Linda: Kind of yes.

JFR: It’s something well below cars. It’s somewhat above literature.

Linda: And nostalgia, they also like it for that.

JFR: And like the fucking baby boomers? They’re shocked to believe that anyone would like the music they liked as a teenager beyond their teenage years. They think that the world began at their birth and now the world is ending.

IV. Performance. Artist.

PM: I once spoke to Paris Hilton’s uncle. He’s a nice guy. But the funny thing he said was, ‘Some of our younger Hiltons are not so interested in, you know philanthropy.’

JFR: Come on.

PM: He really said that.

JFR: Philanthropy. I bet she gives away more money than he does.

Dan: There he goes sticking up for Paris Hilton again.

JFR: Well…

Lala: He thinks that Paris Hilton is actually totally brilliant.

PM: See Keach used to think that too.

KH: [Walking into the room] What?

PM: He thinks Paris Hilton is really brilliant.

KH: I think she’s a performance artist.

Jon: Wow! I’ve never heard that.

PM: She used to have this theory, man.

JFR: Yeah but get this. Here’s the catch: She’s a performance artist for the Right.

KH: Like Anne Coulter? She’s like Anne Coulter overload.

JFR: She’s been sent here from the top down to humiliate women and make them look stupid.

KH: That’s true. But, I admire her as a performance artist more than anything.

V. All The President’s Men

PM: This is all very important.

KH: We’re all doing the important journalistic work right now. This is an act of journalism.

JFR: The one thing is that you’re always like, man why weren’t the fucking tapes rolling?

PM: Yeah, I know. The tape is rolling.

JFR: You know like you have one of those genius moments where suddenly you’re super fucking vulgar in the middle of the afternoon and no one’s there.

PM: The entire article is now based around your Paris Hilton thing.

JFR: Shut up.

PM: Everything, man. It’s all there. It’s all happening, man.

Nathan: Jeff’s like, I’ve never seen her fucking television show.

Dan: He’s making it up.

VI. Selector

KH: You don’t think about it like bass, drums or whatever?

JFR: Nah.

Nathan: Well we’ve played together long enough that you can do everything. You can do both.

Dan: There are no basic chords.

JFR: All of us can play bass or drums.

Dan: Well we all have drum machines.

KH: So you can all make a bass sound or a drum sound.

Dan: Right.

JFR: We can all be the band at any moment.

PM: What I really like is the feeling I get that you guys can make music out of anything.

Dan: Yeah.

Jon: Well anyone can. They just don’t try.

PM: Yeah but I feel like some people can’t though.

JFR: I think our viewpoint has been flavored by our attitude toward music and the fact that we’re all kind of DJs to a degree. I mean once you choose to cross that line you exit being a musician who is a specialist and enter being a chooser.

Nathan: I think that personal line into Excepter has been dissolved over the years because we’ve played together for enough years so now there’s a more pure Excepter happening.

Dan: We’re a lot better live.

Lala: I wouldn’t say that.

JFR: I think we’re sort of weird live. When we played the first time we were basically like all right we’re Ministry and we’re coming to blow you away with beats and frenzy. But when we came up the second time we were actually like we’re Fela [Kuti]. [Laughter]

KH: I think you guys are totally Fela.

PM: We were talking about this when we were cooking earlier. She was wondering, you know some of your songs sound like the devil.

KH: I wondered what is your relationship with the devil?

JFR: I burned my first Bible when I was like 13.

KH: Or is it because the dark notes of the scale are closest together?

Dan: Well this record and the first record are not made from a whole lot of notes and chords and stuff so it’s not really that.

KH: Right

Dan: It’s just the tone and the way the band was with that lineup there was a naturally dark vibe going on. But it’s also dark times you know?

JFR: That’s weird because I don’t really get a dark vibe.

Jon: If you start some kind of new creative project that first thing out is going to be that explosion; all that rage that you feel. Once you get all that shit out, you can be free to express yourself in other ways.

JFR: I remember when I was a 13-year-old I was one of those I-only-like-their-early stuff types.

KH: Sure, but everyone is an I-only-like-the-early-stuff type.

JFR: But you eventually learn to say no, no…

Dan: Their last record is their best record.

KH: I’ve become more of their-last-record-is-the-best-one person.

VII. After School Special

JFR: I got an email to play this benefit for Amnesty International for this high school kid.

Dan: In New Jersey.

JFR: In Bergen, New Jersey.

Jon: It was awesome.

JFR: After school.

Lala: No, yeah it was an Amnesty group thing.

KH: It was like an Amnesty club but for high school, right?

Lala: Yeah.

JFR: But believe me, it was a big deal in their high school. There were like 12 bands there.

PM: Oh my god

JFR: It was the coolest thing I’ve ever seen.

PM: That’s awesome.

JFR: I mean there were all these 15 year olds, like the most integrated, hardcore reproducing Black Flag cover band.

Nathan: Black Flag, Minor Threat, Bad Brains.

JFR: Before a white guy with dreadlocks on a fucking djembe…

Jon: Playing Black Flag covers.

JFR: Playing Black Flag covers.

Nathan: There’s pizza and a cop is there.

Lala: And cookies.

Nathan: And the younger sister of the guy who had us there she’s like six years old and she has a Blood Brothers t-shirt on.

JFR: That’s the kind of situation you want to headline.

KH: That’s the best thing I’ve ever heard in my life.

Dan: I think our connection there graduated.

KH: Did you feel like you were role models?

Nathan: I felt like we were role models. I felt like we were role models because we did some really out there shit and the kids were like oh wow that’s really cool.

PM: Yeah.

Jon: People were dancing.

Linda: The girls.

JFR: Yeah the future sorority sister types were dancing and Caitlin (Cook) was in the band so we had a strong female presence.

VIII. Sun Ra Is On

PM: I have a cell phone, I love my cell phone, but the obsessive use of cell phones is a little much.

Lala: No I think it’s crazy. It’s really weird, it’s weird and actually all kinds of people are on cell phones. Rich people, poor people, everyone’s on a cell phone.

JFR: I like poor people because they use the speaker phone. It used to be only rich people used speaker phone. You used to have to have your own office to use a speaker phone.

PM: [Laughs] Yeah, democratizing the cell phone.

Lala: I would just like to say that I stand IN…IN Line and not on anything.

KH: Yes, wait what the fuck is up with that?

Lala: It makes me mad. I’m in line. I’m not ON line.

KH: Really, what the fuck is up with that?

JFR: Well, Sun Ra would have some words with you.

Lala: Oh really?

JFR: He’s totally against in.

Lala: Sun Ra would never talk to me anyway.

JFR: He’s all about on.

Jon: What?! Sun Ra would hug you! [Laughter]

Lala: No he wouldn’t! Really. [Laughter] He would hate me. I don’t think he would, Jon. I feel like he could never hang out with women. Especially mouthy girls.

IX. Boys Don’t Cry

JFR: Working involves me sitting in front of a computer all day long.

PM: Oh yeah, what do you guys do for day jobs?

JFR: I sit in front of a computer all day long. [Laughter] I wonder how much do you get paid for being the kind of whatever of indie movies? How much does Parker Posey get paid?

KH: I wonder about that.

Lala: I was just going to say Parker Posey.

KH: I would say enough.

JFR: Yeah but how much…

KH: Dollars? That’s a great question.

Lala: I would say $300,000.

JFR: All right. I’ve got a better question. Chloe Sevigny: By her own making?

Dan: Yeah, partially.

JFR: Or was it handed down to her.

KH: Yeah but not entirely which is what makes her Chloe Sevigny.

Dan: She came on with a head start but she’s been at it way longer than people think. [To JFR] You realize because you’ve been in New York the whole time. She was on the cover of Paper magazine in 1993.

JFR: You don’t get paid to be on that.

Dan: But it’s all about getting in and harvesting it.

Nathan: I still think she makes about $350,000 a movie.

KH: Yeah, now.

JFR: Name five movies she’s been in.

Nathan: “Brown Bunny”. “Kids”.

KH: “Big Love” is not a movie but whatever. Um…Oh, “Boys Don’t Cry”! She was so good in Boys Don’t Cry.

Dan: “Shattered Glass”.

JFR: She was using a different level of irony.

KH: In Shattered Glass?

JFR: No, in Boys Don’t Cry. She was like on some sort of irony halo.

KH: I thought she was just being pure.

JFR: What?

KH: I thought she was just being pure. No?

JFR: There’s no pure.

KH: There is.

JFR: Have you ever met actors?

KH: Well, it was because it was colored by Gummo. It was colored by Gummo, OK, so…

JFR: OK, there are musicians, drug dealers…

Linda: Woah, the echelon.

JFR: Fucking cab drivers, filmmakers, prostitutes, actors. And you lead low. [Laughter] And musicians are on the bottom.

KH: You put musicians second.

JFR: No I didn’t.

KH: Musicians were like second.

JFR: Well, I guess I’m on my own level.

KH: Oh.

Lala: Actors are weird. They’re kind of freaky and shallow.

KH: I believed her a hundred percent in Boys Don’t Cry. I believed her a hundred percent.

JFR: That’s because she has no grounding in sexual reality.

KH: I believe Chloe because she’s just like, ‘I can be the chick who works at the mall,’ you know? ‘I can just be whoever.’

JFR: She thinks about being the chick in the mall a lot.

KH: No, I think she is the chick in the mall. I think in her heart she is the chick in the mall.

For more information about Excepter visit www.excepter.com.